Introducing new maps more smoothly

**icky** · 07-03-2008, 06:53 PM

When we introduce new maps onto the server, we always repeat the same routine. For weeks, we have a small number of players who know the map, and a bunch of people who run around, mostly lost (yes, me). It results in lots of players experiencing frustration with new maps and building feelings of dislike which may never be overcome.

Last night, Beatnik had a good idea, and he put the new ctf_escherhaus map on twice in a row, giving people a chance to get into the game and look around a bit before playing it. This was a good step toward easing the new map introduction pain, and it made me wonder if there are other things we could do.

I have my own ideas, but I thought I would poll the audience and see if you guys have any thoughts on the best way to get players over the new map hump.

**DownEast** · 07-03-2008, 08:42 PM

The double map rotation was good, gave me some time to get a grasp on the layout enough that by the time the second one comes around, I can actually do something...Some maps don't need a double run, but this one did...

**jaymind** · 07-03-2008, 09:40 PM

I like the double map rotation myself, it really does give you a throw away round while you learn the map.

**Mosely** · 07-03-2008, 10:24 PM

I thought the double-map was a good move, especially considering the fact that it was a confusing map (with a name like Escher, don't expect linear) and the first round went really quick as scouts were able to make fast getaways.

The alternative approach, I would guess, would be to introduce new maps by having them rotate in more often, like every 4 rounds or something. That would probably achieve the same effect of rotating the map in more often so people get familiar with it.

The escher map was a good one, though, although I think as people get used to it you'll see some serious king-of-the-hill going on at the house/intel points.

**Beatnik** · 07-03-2008, 10:30 PM

While I'd intended to do (and announced) a double round, the map's original configuration was for three rounds, so we actually just went stock on that first time. I'm all for playing a map a few times the first few times it appears on our server though. Many times, the best maps aren't super easy to learn, but that steeper learning curve pays off over time with more interesting maps, so even a "first-look melee round", where the objective is to allow players to run around a bit and not spamkill everyone they see, might also work.

Other ideas would include more Custom Map nights, announced a week in advance, that allow everyone interested to check out the newest custom maps on our server(s). Maybe have these nights twice (say, a Wednesday night and a Sunday afternoon) in the same week, in case certain subgroups can't make a weeknight or a weekend day.

Also, I'd suggest more feedback in the map threads. Give reasoned opinions in the threads and the admins listen. Whine in TS (or worse - in VOIP in-game) and that feedback gets ignored. But we will pay attention to polls and actual feedback in the appropriate threads, or even in PMs sent to admins, so let us know what maps work and don't, and why.

Braidedheadman · 07-04-2008, 12:24 AM

I'll be the first to admit that I've done my share of bitching about new maps that I have experienced frustration with due to my unfamiliarity with them in view of other, more experienced players kicking my ass before I've seen so much as the first point. One in particular that I still find very confusing is that one where (can't remember the name even) the "E" point can be capped out at any time and must be defended in addition to the "A-D" points. Between having my ass handed to my whilst I wander the halls aimlessly and trying to learn my way through, I haven't had a good experience with this map, though I can see where it'd be lots of fun in the end.

I really like this idea, however, and think that it'll do much to offset the learning curve. One thing I might suggest is that we make the first map cycle one where we ask if there are any who would like to look around the map before any serious playing is done and that we devote some time to those people to do a little exploring. For those who are familiar with the map, and to keep them from becoming bored, maybe arrange a place on the map where they can meet and bash in each other's skulls in an all-melee fisticuffs until the rest of the server is ready. Anyone not engaging in the mash should be left in peace to explore.

Cheers!

**BaneII** · 07-04-2008, 12:56 AM

At any time, a player can load a map on their own computer and explore it to their heart's content. There is really no excuse to complain about not knowing a map that's played frequently. If you know it's played frequently, then take the time to do your own walkthrough. It's damned annoying to hear people constantly whine about not knowing their way around a map that's not new anymore; Steel being the number one example.

1. Load TF2.
2. On Main Menu, select Create Server.
3. Choose the map to load.
4. Explore to your heart's content.

**Beatnik** · 07-04-2008, 01:31 AM

Yeah I think the happy medium there is us admins realizing exactly when no-one knows a new map (i.e. the first couple times it's played here) and giving everyone an extra round in which to learn it the first two or 3 times it's played on our server. After that, we can't do much more than that, and we certainly can't halt play more than is absolutely necessary, or the server would empty every time.

But we (as admins) can take that extra step to at least provide a 'warm up' round, possibly melee only, for the first 2 or 3 nights the map is called up, so instead of worrying about a few people new to the map, we're targeting the occassions where most people on the server are new to it.

**Bommando** · 07-04-2008, 02:27 AM

I don't see any need to do a cease-fire orientation walkthrough in the middle of prime-time when people are itching to play. As Bane says, you can load the map up any time. All of our new maps are announced in the TF2 Map Discussion Forum, so if you check that regularly, you'll see what's needed and can even pre-download it and try it out before a round is played on it.

People are also very ready to whine about maps in-game and on TeamSpeak, but make precious few comments on the map threads themselves. If you have constructive feedback on why a map isn't enjoyable, we'll work out whether it's worth keeping and chances are the developer might even read the feedback and make improvements.

**icky** · 07-04-2008, 03:15 AM

I don't feel any desire to load up the map locally and play by myself when I'm itching to play either. It's the happy medium I'm looking for.

I felt like it was a HUGE positive when that map was played twice in a row last night. It gave people a chance to join, do a little scouting, get somewhat oriented, and go.

I think a double map play with the first one being melee might just be the best solution. In particular when the map is loaded for the very first time.