thundeer

We need to play this a lot more so everyone figures out the layout and how to play it; I've played it 3 times total in the last 2 months I think (when we first played it on custom night). Everytime I play it it's been really really close games, with last second ubers and counterubers and overtime and BLEAK KILLING MY UBER MEDIC.

I'll admit, I don't like the spawn camping that happens because the spawns are so close, but like I said in the custom map night thread, all they have to do is make one of the dropdowns go all the way to the 2nd basement level and it'll be fine. Remember everyone can jump over the office partitions near the spawn if you get on the tables first; soldiers use this to shoot the pyro hiding on the other side of the wall and get down to the 2nd level.

I'd also definitely like to see some more varied terrain on the bottom floor true you have the stairs and the vent and the platform on one side, but it would be awesome to have some more cover for sentries or places to hide, cause right now the point itself is just on a wide open space of flat ground.

To attack the easiest way is to get one team near the stairs next to the point, an uber dropping out of the vents (there are 2 entrances to the vents from the 2nd level), and soldiers spamming rockets (now with kritz! i sound like a lolcat everytime i say that) at any sentries near the point or away from the point from the opposite side of the room.

To defend, get the heavy and a sentry next to the point, half the team defends on the point while the other half goes upstairs to hold off the other team. Remember to clear out the vents from all 3 entries, or spam pyro flame/demo bombs through the exit and the vent grating (flame can go through the vent wall, dunno if that was intended or not). Can't leave the point without a counteruber ready, but can't let them camp the spawn either (like castle!). Lots of flanking possibilities in the 2nd floor, plus you get the occasional hiding in the toilets.

Pyros have to keep flanking and clearing out the 2nd floor/vents, heavies need to be a minisentry to watch backs and protect the team on attack (move together!), sit near the point for a counter for defense, soldiers need to spam those rockets from across the room where guns and heavies can't touch you. demos get on the stairs and vents and spam away! Of course you can play any style that fits you, but these are my observations that seem to work from my limited time playing.

Remember the 2nd floor is circular with 2 entries/exits to the top/bottom floor so it's very very easy to get flanked down there. A heavy dropping out of the vents can wreak havoc when no one's paying attention; even without an uber I dropped down and no one was looking at me as a heavy until I tore them up. The gun was down already because a soldier across the room had taken it down w/ rocket spam. I remember one game santa was sitting in the vents camping the point and none of us defending went to flush him out; it's really important on defense to keep that vent clean.

I like the concept, and it's better than that other king of the hill map out there (RAINBOW!!!). Or not. Depends on your current level of inebriation and number of questionable substances consumed.

bleckuhffinity

After tonight's overtime fiasco I'm not sure I ever want to play it again. Such bullshit.

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-F- bleak

icky

I don't like this map. I like the idea of battling over one point, and I like the layout of the basement area, but the spawn exit area is no good. The winner seems to be the team which establishes the best camp outside the opposing spawn.

If it was changed to eliminate the spawn camping, by allowing you to drop into a larger area, then it might actually be a good map.

thundeer

Woah, we have a whole thread on spawn camping, and how it's ok, so I thought it wouldn't be THAT big of an issue? I mean, it's much better than on other maps, cause unlike dustbowl/castle, where if you're spawncamped most likely you're going to lose the round in the next 10 seconds unless you manage to push out IMMEDIATELY and clear the spawn. For this map, you don't have that kind of pressure to rush out because the map won't end (hopefully) for a few more minutes. If necessary you can always use an uber. I've dropped down the righthand hole a couple of times and taken camping pyros and demos by surprise, then jumped over the partitions and taken out another camping pyro, so unfortunately I haven't seen spawncamping as a serious issue yet. Just communicate with your team (remember, you have plenty of time!) so coordinate youselves and aggresively push them back.

Again, it's going to take time for people to get familiar with the map so they know how to play it!!! I'd hate to see people write this map off as a failure just cause we play it once a month.

A cool design I'd like to see is that once the team caps the point, gates open/close so that all 3 exits from the spawn drop all the way down to the basement (very lowest level) and make the spawn is inaccessible from the top level (ie, have a huge gate lowered or something). But maybe this would make the map too much like the other defend/attack maps and defeat the whole purpose of king of the hill?

icky

I'm not sure why you are saying "Woah" and linking to that thread. I'm saying that this is a bad map, not that people shouldn't spawn camp. This map is all about spawn camping, and if you don't take advantage of it, you will probably lose. I would encourage people to dedicate themselves to pushing the opposition back into their spawn and setting up a perimeter on this map. If you win the battle on that first level, the basement can be controlled by 1 or 2 guys and you win the map.

PANDAmonium

Yeah the problem here is that the spawn camp is so accessible, and to reach the bottom you have to fight through three levels of enemies in routes that are fairly predictable. It's difficult to all gather together for any organized push into the bottom floor.

It'd be nice if the area in front of the spawn was safe to the team that owns the spawn, and there were more alternative paths to the bottom floor (you HAVE to pass through the 3rd (second floor you encounter, the one you drop into or take the stairs down).

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Conscript

Bring back the rainbow.

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